We are at a global climate crossroads, and binary thinking dominates much of the conversation … except among green building experts, who prioritize balance above all else. Our interview with Chuck Gallo of Keene Building Products seeks to illuminate this thinking.
Too often in this modern age, sustainability and profitability are seen as opponents in some sort of global green cage match. It’s like the only choices are tree-hugging hippies or Hexxus from Ferngully.
That, however, is far from the case. In fact, recent studies have positively correlated environmental responsibility with financial performance. Green roofs were born of the belief that bringing nature to our cities is the right thing to do, but they will march with us into the future because they truly make good business sense.
One company that is banking on materials that will help us meet the ecological crisis without requiring sacrifice is Keene Building Products. Their entire business model is built on the idea that it’s possible to dream up high-performing solutions — on rooftops as well as at ground level — that help solve the challenges of both today and tomorrow.
Ecogardens was lucky enough to catch up with Chuck Gallo, Senior Product Manager for Water Management, to learn how they’re paving the way to a new approach.
Sustainability for the Modern Age
Gallo wears a lot of hats.
Like, seriously a lot of hats. On any given day, he communicates with customers, architects, consultants, salespeople, product developers, vendors, and baristas. (Really, we’re talking 2-4 espresso shots each morning.)
There’s a reason for this: water management is at the heart of everything Keene does.
“The way we like to explain it is: think of an octopus,” Gallo says. “We’re at the center, and each tentacle is reaching into a different department.”
As Senior Product Manager for Waterproofing & Drainage — what Keene calls Water Management — Gallo’s role touches just about everything. He oversees product changes, from polymers to fabrics, sets pricing, vets suppliers, sources new materials, and works closely with procurement. On any given day, he might be generating leads, mocking up installations, visiting job sites, or helping film marketing content.
He also handles architectural outreach, writes technical letters for contractors to send to architects and consultants to help land projects, and develops CAD details to ensure installations are done right. On top of it all, he understands the importance of branding and works closely with marketing to tailor messaging for each sales channel. (And yes — he’s finishing law school, too. No, he doesn’t sleep eight hours a night. We asked.)
Keene’s goal is always to increase their positive environmental impact through water management.
This naturally leads to the question: What exactly is sustainability to Keene?
“Sustainability isn’t just a box to check; it’s a way of thinking. It’s about building things that last, not just in terms of durability, but in how they impact the environment, the economy, and the people around them. The real question is: How do we create something that holds up over time and makes everything it touches better? That’s where the real value — and the real responsibility — lies.”
~ Chuck Gallo
Resilience is another word that gets bandied around a lot, often used interchangeably in subject matter geared toward laypeople, but are they really the same thing?
“That’s a loaded question,” Gallo says with a laugh. “The answer is both yes and no — it really depends on how you frame it. A product designed with sustainability in mind can also be resilient, but the two don’t always go hand-in-hand. It’s not a one-to-one relationship.”
In other words, a product can be quite resilient in the sense that it’s strong and can stand up to whatever is thrown at it, but only in the near term. It will require replacement in relatively short order, which often means it’s not that sustainable.
The goal at Keene is to make products that are both resilient — i.e. they contribute to the building of high-performing green roofs — but also long-lasting, and therefore sustainable.
The Right Products, the Right Results
The idea of sustainability is all well and good, but how does that translate into material products?
It all starts with your goals.
“Green roofs rely on proper drainage, water retention, and root reinforcement for longevity,” Gallo says. “Using the right products is crucial for stormwater management and to help you manage moisture levels, hydrostatic pressure, and airflow, all of which are important for structural integrity.”
To choose the right water management products for your system, you have to understand your geographic climate.
For instance, Gallo says, if the climate is relatively dry, it’s important to incorporate a water retention layer. That way, the roof will hold onto any rainfall you do get. “That allows plants to access water and thrive in a climate where they might not otherwise have enough.”
On the other hand, if you live in an area that sees a lot of precipitation, then you’ll need to manage stormwater intelligently.
In either type of climate, he says, the drainage layer is fundamental — and so is choosing the right one, which depends on a number of factors: “Understanding the flow rate of that drainage layer under different compressive loads at a specific hydraulic gradient will help you decide which drainage size or product to go with.”
And if that sounded like gibberish to you, well, that’s why we have people like Gallo in the world.
Other concerns when designing green roofs, depending on the climate and structure, include:
- Draining away large volumes of water in areas where rain and snow are common
- Providing the proper airflow for both plants and the movement of water
- Managing the compressive load, or the force exerted downwards on a roof structure due to its weight
- Choosing the right root barrier, according to the types of plants you want to use
Systems Determine Products
Products also differ depending on the type of system: extensive, semi-intensive, or intensive.
An extensive green roof, for example, is one on which you have no more than 6 inches of growing media and as few as 2 inches. This will necessarily constrain your plant options, so nobody’s growing trees on an extensive green roof. The goal here is to move stormwater, increase energy efficiency, and cool down cities.
On the other hand, intensive systems provide media up to 2 feet thick, which can handle large species such as trees and shrubs. Intensive green roofs usually support human traffic. Semi-intensive is somewhere in between, with 6 to 12 inches of media.
How does this impact the products you use, then?
Let’s take root barriers as an example.
“If you’re doing extensive or semi-intensive, then you’re likely okay with a 20-millimeter-thick root barrier,” Gallo says. He recommends high-density polyethylene over any other type of product, because it’s the most robust of the polymers. It also has the strongest tensile strength and elasticity, so it’s best at warding off root punctures.
Want to put structures and trees in? He recommends shifting upward to 30 millimeters. Although some people will take it even further, to 40 millimeters, he steers clear. “It’s overkill and hard to work with. It doesn’t want to conform to parapets or bend the way it should. Don’t go over 30.”
Of course, the choice of root barrier is just one decision. Then you’ve got water retention mats, which differ depending on whether you need to manage lots of water or hang onto every drop.
“When it comes to green roofs, getting water off the membrane quickly is critical — and that’s where entangled net systems shine,” Gallo says. “Their 3D structured strand design is 99 percent open, so water drains fast and air circulates freely. That airflow is just as important — it helps keep the assembly dry and healthy over time.”
On the other hand, “If you’re looking for a project where you need to hold an inch of rainfall or are in a dry climate where you need to hold water as long as possible, use 1-inch mineral wool, or multiple layers of a polyester fiber mat.” It’s not everyone’s favorite to work with, he says, but it’s the best on the market for retaining lots of water.
Those are just a few of the possible examples, too.
No matter what product you’re talking about, the goal is always to minimize disruption to infrastructure while providing the best possible result. "What you build with matters: A green roof’s environmental impact depends heavily on the products used.
“In a snapshot, the right products can significantly reduce a building’s environmental footprint by improving stormwater management, enhancing energy efficiency, and enhancing the lifespan of green infrastructure.”
~ Chuck Gallo
By ensuring efficient drainage and vegetation support, reducing the urban heat island effect, and improving air quality, Keene’s products help contribute to sustainable urban development overall.
That’s today. What about tomorrow?
Bridging the Needs of Today With the Goals of Tomorrow
Your parents weren’t lying when they told you that life is all about compromises. Chances are, they were telling you to let your sister choose the cartoon that morning, but this universal truth applies just as much (more?) to adults … and nowhere is it truer than in the green building industry.
Plastics, for instance, are a delicate balance in that … well, they’re just not great, obviously. However, plastic is very good at what it does, and neither Keene nor anyone else has come up with a way to replace it entirely.
“There are people who have developed biodegradable polymers,” Gallo acknowledges. “However, if our products completely biodegraded, those structures would be in trouble.”
[Brief intermission while we all LOL at the idea of a biodegradable root barrier.]
“I think recycled is our best approach at the moment,” he concludes. At Keene, they strive every day to reduce the amount of virgin polymers and fibers in their products, and they’re getting better at recycling all the time.
Currently, their root barriers are composed of 70% post-industrial recycled content, while their Trident dimple drains are at 80% and AquaBalance products have reached a hallowed 100% post-industrial recycled content. Keene is shooting to get every drainage product to a minimum of 30% by the end of 2025.
“At Keene, we strive every day to become more ecofriendly. We do everything we can to get as much recycled material as possible into our products without sacrificing performance.”
~ Chuck Gallo
They take these expectations to their vendors as well, asking them to complete supply assessments where they score Keene on its environmental impact. In areas where improvement is possible, they look into those factors right away.
Sometimes there are challenges, and they meet resistance here and there, as with one of their solvent-based adhesives. Gallo would love to get rid of it, “but I have too many people down in Texas that bang on their desks and say, ‘My grandpa used this and it works!’”
Like we said: compromises. Keene might not be at net-zero yet, but they’re working hard to bridge the needs of today with the goals of tomorrow.
“We are in an industry that isn’t ecologically friendly by nature,” Gallo admits, “but we’re striving to be greener each year.”
Partnering for Maximum Longevity, Maximum Durability
This isn’t a solo journey Gallo is on.
For one thing, Greg Raymond of Ecogardens regularly consults on sales strategy at Keene, a partnership that has proven long and fruitful.
For another, Gallo works with others constantly to offer his technical expertise and product guidance. From giving American Institute of Architects presentations that help architects understand the building science aspects of green roofs, to figuring out how to integrate Keene products with those of other manufacturers, he’s busy all the time.
These partnerships help ensure the maximum longevity and durability of installations. With each customized system, often heavily influenced by input from Gallo, he ensures best practices in green infrastructure.
However, we’re not there yet. The more we can focus on greening up materials as well as whole systems, the better off we’ll be. Climate change is real, and it’s not going to get better magically, he says.
“The reality is that many manufactured materials carry an environmental cost. But with that awareness comes opportunity. Climate change challenges us to innovate better, cleaner, and more responsibly in everything we produce.”
~ Chuck Gallo
We all have to do our part to ensure our great-grandkids have a world to live in, he says.
We’re just happy Chuck Gallo is doing his.